Argaman

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Username: Yitzchok Mickler
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Can murex trunculus be used to make purple dye for the Cohen Gadol's clothes? Was that what was used when we had a Beit Hamikdash?
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Philo writes that murex was used for argaman (techeiles he doesn't specify what its source is). However see Rabbi Yisroel Rosenberg's work on this subject (somewhere on the techeiles.org website)
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Hi anyone interested learning about arguman can download it from here

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This following is an excerpt from Bochart chapter 10  Which is why the Poets call whatever is purple … such as the sun and dawn.Vergil in Ciris: Between the purple suns and white stars of the moon ......and in Aetna:  the golden light reddening with purplish purple would rise.Ovid Metamorphoses Book 3: Which color is usual for clouds struck[1] by the blow of the opposing[2] sun[3] or of purple dawn.and Book 6: ...... as the sky is want to become purple when dawn first appears.And in the letter of Phaedra to Hippolytus: who moves the warm day with purple car.And of Cydippe to Acontius:  The sun would wish to remove the yoke(s) from his purple steeds.     written in an article called "millennia of murex" in the Paragraph which starts “Our ancestors” it states as follows "As a color, however, “purple” encompassed all the shades that could be obtained from the murex family of shellfish, from ultramarine to pink. Which color resulted depended on what species’ pigment went into the dye pot, what it was or wasn’t mixed with, for how long and how many times the yarn or cloth was dyed and even the season in which the shellfish had been harvested. Faced with such a rainbow, “purple” was not so much a color as a notion, a status" [1] /tinged[2] /oppostie[3] (the facing sun)

 
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Thank you Mr. Genugshoin and מראה הרקיע.
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מראה wrote:Thu Jan 01, 1970 12:01 am This following is an excerpt from Bochart chapter 10  Which is why the Poets call whatever is purple … such as the sun and dawn.Vergil in Ciris: Between the purple suns and white stars of the moon ......and in Aetna:  the golden light reddening with purplish purple would rise.Ovid Metamorphoses Book 3: Which color is usual for clouds struck[1] by the blow of the opposing[2] sun[3] or of purple dawn.and Book 6: ...... as the sky is want to become purple when dawn first appears.And in the letter of Phaedra to Hippolytus: who moves the warm day with purple car.And of Cydippe to Acontius:  The sun would wish to remove the yoke(s) from his purple steeds.     written in an article called "millennia of murex" in the Paragraph which starts “Our ancestors” it states as follows "As a color, however, “purple” encompassed all the shades that could be obtained from the murex family of shellfish, from ultramarine to pink. Which color resulted depended on what species’ pigment went into the dye pot, what it was or wasn’t mixed with, for how long and how many times the yarn or cloth was dyed and even the season in which the shellfish had been harvested. Faced with such a rainbow, “purple” was not so much a color as a notion, a status" [1] /tinged[2] /oppostie[3] (the facing sun)

 
purple sky.jpg
 
 
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From Rabbi Dr. Herzog:
https://porphyrology.com/view-doctorate ... testament/
That Argaman was blatta purple1 (i.e., dyed with marine snail pigment) is attested by the Septuagint, the oldest translation of the Pentateuch. Wherever Argaman occurs in the Torah it is rendered by Porphyra or one of its derivatives, and this rendering is indeed adhered to throughout the rest of the Bible. Tekhelet, whether occurring by itself or in close association with Argaman, is represented by Iakinthos. The impression thus created is that Tekhelet does not fall under the appellation Prophyra. I do not wish to imply that Porphyra was not elastic enough to be used sometimes as a term embracing all kinds of purple, including Iakinthos, but that in its ordinary sense it denoted fabrics distinctly differing in colour from Iakinthos, so that its conjunction with the latter term involved no clashing or overlapping.
https://porphyrology.com/view-doctorate ... f-argaman/
In a recent contribution to the etymology of Tekhelet and Argaman, the writer, Dr. Riedel, reaches the novel conclusion that Tekhelet should be rendered by purple and Argaman by Indian-red (Indisch rot)1. Thus Argaman according to him is not purple at all but a vegetable dyestuff. He refers, of course, at the very beginning of his essay to the Greek versions, but Iakinthos he misunderstands and Porphyra for Argaman he simply rejects.2 For the present suffice it to remark that Riedel has reckoned without the host. It is all very well arguing the incorrectness of this or that rendering in the old versions, but in a case like the present one, any amount of argument and dialectic is so much empty talk. The authors of the LXX, Philo and Josephus, all lived in times when both Tekhelet and Argaman were used in the temple. Josephus indeed officiated himself in the Sanctuary. Their renderings are not merely renderings; they are unimpeachable testimonies that Tekhelet and Argaman in the days of the Second Temple were known as, and designated by, Iakinthos and Porphyra respectively. The worst that the most sceptical mind could do would be to doubt whether the priestly authorities of the Second Temple rightly interpreted these terms, and whether they had not been better advised had they consulted some Biblical scholar who might have taught them to adopt “Indisch rot” instead of purple for the Argaman of the sacerdotal vestments and of the temple curtains.
 
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